298 – Keith Harris of Albuquerque, NM A Retired Business Owner, Father Of Four, Including One With Down Syndrome – Part 2

Transcript:

Tom Couch: [00:00:00] Special thanks to Horizon Therapeutics for sponsoring the Special Fathers Network Dad to Dad Podcast, working tirelessly to research, develop, and bring forward medicines for people living with rare and rheumatic diseases. Discover more about Horizon Therapeutics’ mission at HorizonTherapeutics. com.

Keith Harris: The restaurant was known for breakfast, lunch, and hugs. Didn’t have a lot of non-negotiables in how the restaurant was to be set up, but he insisted that somehow Tim Hugs needed to appear on his menu.

David Hirsch: No extra cost for a Tim Hug?

Keith Harris: F-R-E-E. Tim insisted on those letters right next to that item on the menu.

Tom Couch: That’s our guest this week, Keith Harris, an entrepreneur and father of four, including his son Tim, age 38, who has Down syndrome. Keith and Tim opened and ran a restaurant. Tim has written a children’s book available on Amazon, and they’ve formed Tim’s Big Heart Foundation, changing the world one hug at a time. This is the second of the two-part interview where Keith [00:01:00] Harris tells us about the importance of hugs to his son Tim, their restaurant promising hugs to all, and a meeting with President Obama in which Tim – you guessed it – gave a big old hug to the Commander in Chief. It’s the conclusion of this fascinating story on this Special Fathers Network Dad to Dad Podcast. Now say hello to the founder of the Special Fathers Network and host of the Dad to Dad Podcast, David Hirsch.

David Hirsch: Hi, and thanks for listening to the Special Fathers Network Dad to Dad Podcast, presented by the Special Fathers Network, a dad to dad mentoring program for fathers raising children with special needs.

The Special Fathers Network MasterMind group experience is the most comprehensive program the 21st Century Dads Foundation offers. Dads raising children with special needs meet virtually on a weekly basis and form meaningful relationships while sharing weekly wins, discussing books, and sharing heartfelt challenges. One of the highlights of the year is attending an in-person weekend retreat. We’re launching 10 new [00:02:00] MasterMind groups in 2024 with 10 dads per group. That means we’re only looking for 10 like-minded dads in each community. If you’re a dad raising a child with special needs, we hope you’ll join a local MasterMind group and make the investment to become the best version of yourself. For more information, please see the show notes or simply go to 21stCenturyDads.org.

Tom Couch: Now let’s hear this final installment of this conversation between Keith Harris and David Hirsch.

David Hirsch: I’m thinking about supporting organizations and I’m wondering what organizations come to mind that Tim’s benefited from directly or maybe your family has benefited from as a result of Down syndrome.

Keith Harris: Tim discovered Special Olympics when he was about 13 and has been very involved with Special Olympics locally, nationally, and internationally. It’s been a real neat forum for him to really come into his own, to have friends that he competes with, to have the pageantry of their big opening ceremonies and the exhilaration of winning a race or winning a basketball game or a volleyball game. They’ve been [00:03:00] absolutely incredible for his development.

We’ve also worked a lot with our local Down syndrome organization. They’re called the Rio Grande Down Syndrome Network. They have regular community events and picnics and fundraising walks, things like that.

We’ve also been involved since Tim was a baby with a national organization called the National Down Syndrome Congress. They’re headquartered in Atlanta and they’re most well known for their annual convention. They organize the largest convention of its type in the world every summer. It draws anywhere from 2,000 to about 5,000 participants from around the world. And they’re mostly families that have a family member with Down syndrome, but also quite a few academics and medical professionals come to the conference. It’s been an amazing networking opportunity for us as a family.

David Hirsch: It sounds like it. Thank you for sharing. And just to be clear, you mentioned about Special Olympics locally, nationally, internationally. You mentioned basketball and volleyball. Were those his two main sports or did he play other sports as well?

Keith Harris: He’s got a lot of sports, David. I know [00:04:00] if he listens to this he’ll correct me because I’ll leave something out. But in the winter, like right now, the season is a sport called polyhockey which is like ice hockey, but on a gymnasium floor without ice. And then late spring and summer are the summer games and he competes in track and field. He does the pentathlon and quite a few sprinting events. Also plays volleyball during the summer games. And then in the fall his favorite sport is basketball. And a few seasons, he’s done golf and softball. I think I’m getting close to the complete list, but he’ll definitely correct me when he hears this.

David Hirsch: Were you here in Chicago for the 50 year anniversary gathering?

Keith Harris: No.

David Hirsch: Okay.

Keith Harris: We were not but it started right there where you are.

David Hirsch: Oh, yeah. And it was amazing just to be surrounded with people from I think it was 120 different countries.

Keith Harris: Yeah.

David Hirsch: It was wild. It was wild.

Keith Harris: Yeah. We were part of the 50th anniversary celebration We were guests at the White House during the Obama administration. President and Mrs. Obama were the honorary chairs of the World Games in Los [00:05:00] Angeles that were in commemoration of the 50th anniversary. They hosted an event at the White House in 2014 to celebrate the 50th anniversary of Special Olympics. We got to be Tim’s guests for an evening at the White House, and Tim got to give a very unscripted spontaneous hug to the President of the United States that night.

[Audio excerpt from the White House event]

President Barack Obama: Tim Harris is a special Olympian in basketball, polyhockey, volleyball, golf, and track and field so he has all four seasons covered. Now he has a restaurant in Albuquerque called Tim’s Place. The most popular item is the hug Tim gives his customers. And so far, more than 42,000 have been served. So where’s Tim? There he is right there. [applause] Tim. Tim. Tim’s fired up. Although Tim, I didn’t get a hug. Come on, man. Oh here we go. Alright. Come on. Come on.

Tim: I love you, Obama.

Preseident Barack Obama: I love you back. [applause] See, you know, presidents need some encouragement once in a while, too. That felt really good. That was nice. Thank you, Tim.

[End of audio excerpt]

And then a year later, in 2015, during the Summer Games Tim was asked to introduce First Lady Michelle Obama at the opening [00:06:00] ceremonies for the World Games in front of 65,000 people at the LA Coliseum and a worldwide television audience on ESPN.

David Hirsch: That’s wild. Yeah, thanks for sharing. It’s obvious that Special Olympics has played a really important role in Tim’s life and your family’s life for that matter.

Keith Harris: Most definitely.

David Hirsch: Yeah. It’s not lost on me, when we were first starting the Special Fathers Network, we were warmly embraced by Dave Breen, who’s the longtime Executive Director, President of Special Olympics Illinois.

Keith Harris: Fantastic.

David Hirsch: Yeah, if it wasn’t for Dave Breen and a couple of others, I don’t know that we would actually be having this conversation today. I have a special place in my heart for different reasons, for Special Olympics as well.

Let’s talk about special needs beyond your own family situation. You’ve shared with me in a prior conversation a number of different experiences and one that stuck in mind was this restaurant that you started named Tim’s Place. And I’m wondering what’s the backstory and what can you share with our listeners today?

Keith Harris: When Tim was about 13 or 14 years old, [00:07:00] so right at the transition between middle school and high school, he started telling his friends that someday he wanted to own a restaurant. It was a curiosity to me that he would say that. And I think he was a kid who really always loved the idea when we went out to a restaurant. He loved the whole experience, the whole vibe. And he is such a connector that he would, even as a little boy in a restaurant, he would excuse himself to go to use the restroom, right? And then he wouldn’t come back. And we would go, either me or one of his brothers or Jeannie would go looking for him, and he’d be sitting there talking to some tables, [David laughing] introducing himself to people that were dining in the restaurant and having a great conversation. And it’s kind of part of who he is.

During high school, he wound up getting a job here in Albuquerque at a chain restaurant called Red Robin. It’s a burger place. I don’t know if you have those in Illinois, but he was a host there. And the general manager called me to a meeting after Tim had been there for a couple of months. I thought as a dad that Tim might have been in trouble, right? But he had all of his financial reports, his daily reports, sitting in front of [00:08:00] him. And he said, “Mr. Harris, our sales are up about 20 percent on the shifts that Tim works. Can you explain that to me?” I’m like, “Not exactly because I’m not there.” But I did know that a lot of Tim’s friends from high school started coming to that restaurant faithfully and a lot of our friends came and then more importantly a lot of people from the community that didn’t know Tim that had kids with special needs started frequenting that restaurant. I was really proud of the effect he was having on that store. And the entrepreneur in me sort of, the light bulb kicked in and said, wow, if he’s able to make money through his influence for a corporation, could that be harnessed for himself?

And so we started to get serious about thinking about a restaurant for him. And in 2010, that came to fruition. We opened a restaurant called Tim’s Place here in Albuquerque and it was open for breakfast and lunch. We were open from 7am till 2:30pm with the idea that Tim could still have a life in the evening.

The restaurant was known for breakfast, lunch and hugs. Tim didn’t have a lot of non-negotiables in how the restaurant was to be set [00:09:00] up, but he insisted that somehow Tim Hugs needed to appear on his menu. That’s exactly what happened in the restaurant. When you opened up the menu, the first thing that you noticed was an item called a Tim Hug. We explained to Tim that a lot of people for whatever reasons, their own trauma, a lot of people don’t like to be touched by other people. That’s certainly their right. So we set it up in the restaurant that Tim only hugged customers when they requested a hug. So it was on the menu as something that you would order. And it said, talk to a host or hostess or to your server if you want to order a Tim Hug. So that was part of the business model was a lot of hugs.

David Hirsch: No extra cost for a Tim Hug?

Keith Harris: F-R-E-E. Tim insisted on those letters [David laughing] right next to that item on the menu. He kept track of those, David, every day with a little golf score counter in his pocket. So he’d deliver a hug, reach in his pocket, you’d hear a little click. And at the end of every shift, the managers would look at his counter, and they had a little remote control. We had an electronic hug counter on the wall. So daily that number got updated. When the restaurant [00:10:00] closed in 2015, Tim was somewhere in excess of 75,000 official hugs. There were lots and lots more than that that didn’t get counted, but 75,000 official hugs that were delivered in that place.

David Hirsch: Yeah. It reminds me of McDonald’s. There would be the ‘burgers served’ up on the sign in front of all the restaurants.

Keith Harris: Yeah.

David Hirsch: And I don’t know if you have Jimmy John’s there in Albuquerque.

Keith Harris: We do.

David Hirsch: And they serve, irreverently, talk about, “Free smells,” right? You can get free smells if you’re at Jimmy Johns.

Keith Harris: Free smells, yeah. It was very much like that. Very much like that.

David Hirsch: Yeah, I love it. Thanks for sharing. What a great experience all around. And the second thing that came to mind, and it had to do with Tim’s passion for hugs, is the children’s book.

Keith Harris: Yeah.

David Hirsch: And I’m wondering if you can share with our listeners the backstory on that, the title and what the premise for that book is.

Keith Harris: Yeah. So the backstory is that my wife and I have some friends in Canada. Our friend, Anne, is a co-owner of a company called Flowerpot Press. She and her brother own and [00:11:00] run the company. And I think last time I looked, they were the second largest publisher of children’s books in North America. And when Anne really got to know Tim some years back, it really clicked in her mind that someday she wanted her company to take on the idea of working with Tim to create a book through a series of steps. We came to the conclusion that they were ready to move forward with that idea.

And so her brother, Pat, who is the CEO of the company came to spend a few days with us. Spent a bunch of one-on-one time with Tim and recorded, audio recorded the entire time he was with Tim. From their conversations he pulled down a concept and all of the text for a book and it’s called The Book of Hugs.

It was collaboratively written by Pat Hayes, the CEO, and Tim together. Pat says that every word in the book are Tim’s words, not his words, but he helped him weave that into a really compelling story for kids. And so it’s the story of a character called Teddy Bear Tim. And if Tim is sitting with you, [00:12:00] David, he will point to that character and whisper to you, “That’s really me,” as if you couldn’t make that connection. Throughout the book, the Teddy Bear is teaching his friends who are young monkeys about the art and science of hugging. The different types of hugs, when they’re appropriate, when they’re not, and the idea that consent and permission needs to be part of the whole equation.

The book has done phenomenally well commercially. It’s available on Amazon and Barnes and Noble, lots and lots of local bookstores. So Tim has the enviable title of a published author to add to his considerable resume.

David Hirsch: Would you refer to that as a bestselling published author, or not?

Keith Harris: That’s a subjective term, but yes. There were quite a few months where it was in the top four or five children’s books sold by Amazon. I can also measure that by the royalty checks Tim’s been getting. So they’ve been coming in quite regularly.

David Hirsch: That’s fabulous. Thanks for sharing.

Keith Harris: Absolutely.

David Hirsch: And then the third thing that I recall from a prior conversation is that you’ve created a family foundation and it’s got two different [00:13:00] focuses: the Tim’s Big Heart Foundation and then work that you do separately, healing of trauma for those who are serving.

Keith Harris: Correct.

David Hirsch: Military, first responders. And I’m wondering if you could just speak to each of those briefly.

Keith Harris: Absolutely. Our new 501c3 is called The Harris Family Foundation, and it’s newly incorporated here in New Mexico. Just getting up and running in a big way this year. Like you mentioned, we have two program areas or focus areas.

The first is separately branded as Tim’s Big Heart Foundation. And in that particular enterprise, we are working in a couple of Caribbean countries, island nations, as well as here in New Mexico. I guess the best way to describe it is we’re endeavoring, through a variety of methods, to help families expand their vision for what might be possible for their young child with a disability. When I look back over my life experience from the time Tim was very young, I met people who were further along the path than me that really opened my eyes to possibility. [00:14:00] And it was sorely needed for me when Tim was very young. It’s really easy, like you say, to pay attention to Google and things like that that can paint a pretty pessimistic vision of the future. And so we’re working pretty diligently in those places to help families that have young kids catch a glimpse of a different future. And couldn’t be more excited about that.

David Hirsch: What are the two countries that you made reference to earlier?

Keith Harris: Jamaica and Grenada are the two countries that we’re working in in the Caribbean. And recently about six months ago, we’ve circled back to add our home state of New Mexico. And New Mexico, for those that don’t know, that is the state that ranks 49th or 50th on most of the lists. And so when Tim heard me speak about we’re working in places with less resources, he’s asking me, “Dad, isn’t New Mexico one of those places?” [David chuckles] I’m like, “Yes, you are not wrong, sir.” So that’s our current service area. We hope to eventually, as time permits, to expand into more and more Caribbean countries, as well as ultimately into Central and South America. These are places we’ve spent a lot of time and have a lot of connections.

David Hirsch: Is [00:15:00] it because of your sailing that you made connections in Jamaica and Grenada then, or not?

Keith Harris: Yeah, definitely. Within that decision making matrix, my wife Jeannie and I, after we sold our technology company in 2017, set out to live aboard our sailboat. We’d been sailing for about close to 20 years prior to that part time, including sometimes many months of the year. Once we were finally free from the shackles of business ownership, we bought a one-way ticket to Florida and boarded our boat. Went to Costco, bought a bunch of groceries, checked out of the marina, and set off for the Caribbean. And spent about four to five years making the boat our home, and visited 23 countries slowly making our way through the Caribbean basin.

David Hirsch: That’s amazing. That’s one of those bucket list type of experiences that most people only think about or dream about, and what an amazing experience for you to actually…

Keith Harris: Yeah, it was an amazing experience for us. Like we still talk about it most every day. But about three years [00:16:00] ago we became grandparents. We knew, Jeannie and I knew, that there was a specific window of time between when we would sell our company and when we would have grandkids. We decided together that we would make the most out of our sailing life during those years. And we did. But once we found out that our youngest son was expecting what is now our oldest granddaughter, we decided it was time to hang up the Jimmy Buffett lifestyle. So we sold our boat and moved back to land right here in Albuquerque.

David Hirsch: Yeah. There might be some sailing in your future, even if it’s not at that same level, right? That’s pretty extreme, right? To be able to pack it all in and just sail for months and months at a time. Years.

Keith Harris: Yeah. We definitely have aspirations to do a lot more sailing, but just in a different way.

David Hirsch: Maybe when the grandkids get to be a little older.

Keith Harris: Yeah, absolutely. You got it.

Tom Couch: We’ll be back with more of the conversation on the Special Fathers Network Dad to Dad Podcast in just a few moments. But first, this quick message. Please help 21st Century Dads gather research on families raising children with special [00:17:00] needs by having them complete the Special Fathers Network Early Intervention Parents Survey. A link to the survey can be found in the show notes. As a token of our appreciation, each person, mom or dad, who completes the survey, will receive a Great Dad Coin. Thank you. Now back to the conversation.

David Hirsch: The second part of the foundation, other than Tim’s Big Heart Foundation, being focused on serving families in a couple of Caribbean nations as well as New Mexico, has to do with serving those who chose careers that experience some trauma.

Keith Harris: Yeah.

David Hirsch: Mostly first responders, military. And what’s the backstory there?

Keith Harris: I guess I can map all this really back to my kids, right? My youngest son, David, his name is John, is a firefighter here in Albuquerque. He’s a lieutenant. Just walking through these last dozen years or so with John, I have gotten to see, not firsthand but secondhand, what the reality is for people in that profession. They wind up at the scene of every horrific car accident, every shooting, stabbing, mugging. When they’re on [00:18:00] shift, they wind up experiencing a lot of things that the rest of us don’t have to see because they’re willing to do it. And I’m really moved by how much trauma my son carries and people like him carry.

And so we’ve decided to dedicate part of our mission with our family foundation to providing certain trauma healing services to those who have selflessly picked a career to be in service to their fellow man, and in doing so have picked up some trouble along the way. So we’re focused specifically on returning combat veterans, first responders in the form of police officers and firefighters and EMS personnel, as well as individuals who work on the front lines of health care. That a lot of those folks were pretty badly beaten up during COVID and prior to COVID. People that work in oncology wards, trauma centers, emergency rooms. It’s a heavy lift for a lot of people. And there’s just, in my opinion, just not enough things made available to those groups. So we’re trying to figure out what’s the best way to have the [00:19:00] maximum impact in that field.

David Hirsch: Yeah my hat’s off to you and Jeannie for having that insight informed by your son John’s experience as a first responder, as a firefighter. And there’s no question in my mind that while people associate PTSD with combat veterans and all that they see and do, similar experiences which are hard to measure because they’re not visible. There are things that impact us mentally and emotionally.

Keith Harris: Yep.

David Hirsch: These wounds or these scars remain invisible to the general public but haunt people in different ways. And higher incidences of suicide and it traumatizes people and it comes out in different ways.

Keith Harris: Yeah.

David Hirsch: They’re not able to maintain relationships like they would have been otherwise, marriages, or be the parents, moms and dads, that they would have been otherwise because of the trauma that they’ve shouldered. And great that you’re helping fill that void or bridge that gap, meet that unmet need that I think that exists in society.

Keith Harris: Yeah. Thank you. Thank you. [00:20:00] It just feels like such a great alignment for me of my life’s experience as an entrepreneur and as a dad and then just these two threads of our foundation. Each one is directly linked to one of my sons. But it’s a greater need. It’s not about my sons, right? It’s about who they represent

David Hirsch: Yeah. Your son’s experiences have informed you and Jeannie about different aspects or elements of society. And this is just the beginning. This is a new foundation. Who’s to say there won’t be a third or a fourth or a fifth thread for that matter that you weave into that?

Keith Harris: Absolutely.

David Hirsch: So I’m thinking about spirituality and I’m curious to know what, if any, role that’s played in your lives.

Keith Harris: I have a long and varied history in terms of traditional religion. I guess if I fast forward to age 67, I am 100 percent certain that I am part of something – we all are – that’s much larger than we are. That’s much larger than we are. And I consider myself to be a profoundly spiritual man and seek guidance each and every day from a [00:21:00] source that’s bigger than me. I guess that’s the best way to describe it. And measure that, David, in so many ways by how I feel when I am setting out to do the work I’m setting out to do. It’s almost like being on some sort of a beam. And inside my heart, I can feel when I’m lined up on that beam. And that’s my guidestone, I would say, these days.

David Hirsch: Yeah thanks for sharing. And I love that visual image of being on a beam and being in alignment, balancing if you will between different elements in our lives. And a lot of people don’t get much past the work-family balance in their lives. And maybe now that you’ve hung up your work spurs, you’re looking to match your resources and your values, right? And that’s what I hear you talking about.

Keith Harris: You are exactly right with that assessment. You’re exactly right.

David Hirsch: So I’m thinking about advice, and I’m wondering, maybe beyond the scope of the conversation we’ve had, if there’s any specific advice you’d offer parents, specifically dads, who find that they have a child with a [00:22:00] diagnosis.

Keith Harris: Yeah. I think first and foremost, I would tell a new dad or a young dad that you and your spouse are the experts as it comes to your child. I see so many young families get so confused by what a counselor told them, or a social worker told them, or a therapist, or a teacher. First and foremost, trust yourself that you know what’s best for your family, what’s best for your child. Listen to other people, but they’re not in charge. You are. That’d be piece of advice number one.

And piece of advice number two would be don’t accept limits for your child or your family based on a diagnosis. If you tune in and listen to what I would call ‘the system’, you might get a very minimalist view of what the future might hold for you and your family and your child. Again, I urge everyone to listen to all inputs, but ultimately reach for the stars that you don’t know until you try.

David Hirsch: Two pearls of wisdom. You know your child better than anyone else possibly could. And then don’t put any limits on any of your children, whether they’re typical or atypical, for that matter.

Keith Harris: [00:23:00] That’s right.

David Hirsch: Only God knows what is possible. And who are we to judge what somebody is capable of doing or not capable of doing. So thank you.

Keith Harris: Yeah. No, you’re right. It’s that potential is in God’s hands, not in our hands. It’s naive of us in many ways to think that we’re the one that’s going to set the cap.

David Hirsch: Absolutely. So I’m curious to know, why is it that you’ve agreed to be a mentor father as part of the Special Fathers Network?

Keith Harris: It just has so much meaning. When I think of myself, David, as a younger Keith raising young Tim, and how many points along that path I came across a father who was older than me and had more experience than me that put his hand out and had a kind word, a piece of advice, or just a knowing smile, right? Sometimes it’s all of those things. And I’m a big believer in the circle of life, right? That there’s a time for me when I was young and I was drinking in advice, right? And it’s now time at my age to be thinking about giving that back. So it’s just as simple as that. So it’s a desire to serve as I have been served.

David Hirsch: Yeah. We’re thrilled to have you. Thank you. That [00:24:00] image that you made reference to the drinking the water, if you will, brings to mind a very positive influence that took place when I was in my mid thirties. And I don’t know if you’ve ever heard of the concept of the dipper and the bucket. Does that ring a bell with you at all?

Keith Harris: No.

David Hirsch: Don Clifton, who was the head of the Gallup Leadership Institute in Lincoln, Nebraska, was the creator of this concept. It was a pamphlet and then it morphed into books, multiple books. The dipper and the bucket. And the simple concept is that we each carry around a bucket on our backs.

Keith Harris: Yep.

David Hirsch: And people have the ability to fill our buckets. And when your bucket is full, it’s overflowing, you’re invincible, right? You can do anything. And then we also have the ability to drain people’s buckets, right? Take dips out of people’s buckets, empty their buckets. And when you’re empty, there’s not a lot of hope, right? You don’t have a lot of confidence. And that’s the image that came to mind when you were talking about drinking, right? [00:25:00] You’re taking in all this information, energy, positivity from others, and that at some point, you realize, hey, maybe it’s time to do the same for others, right? That’s what I heard you saying.

Keith Harris: Yeah.

David Hirsch: Is there anything else you’d like to say before we wrap up?

Keith Harris: I think we’ve covered a lot of ground. I’m very happy.

David Hirsch: Yeah it’s been a pleasure. Thank you. Let’s give a special shout out to Randy Miscorella at Special Olympics New Mexico for helping connect us.

Keith Harris: Absolutely, yeah. I will definitely be calling her later today.

David Hirsch: If somebody wants to learn more about The Book of Hugs, your family foundation, or contact you, what’s the best way to do that?

Keith Harris: They can find us online at TimsBigHeartFoundation.org. That would be the very best way. Or do any kind of a Google search on Tim Harris Down Syndrome and you will definitely find us.

David Hirsch: Okay. I’ll be sure to include that in the show notes. That’ll make it as easy as possible for somebody to follow up with you.

Keith Harris: Yeah, thank you.

David Hirsch: Keith, thank you for your time and many insights. As a reminder, Keith’s just one of the dads who’s part of the Special Fathers Network, a mentoring program for fathers raising a child with special needs. If you’d like to be a [00:26:00] mentor father or are seeking advice from a mentor father with a similar situation to your own, please go to 21stCenturyDads.org.

Thank you for listening to the latest episode of the Special Fathers Network Dad to Dad Podcast. I hope you enjoyed the conversation as much as I did. As you probably know, the 21st Century Dads Foundation is a 501c3 not for profit organization, which means we need your help to keep our content free to all concerned. Would you please consider making a tax-deductible contribution? I would really appreciate your support. Keith, thanks again.

Keith Harris: Thank you, David.

Tom Couch: And thank you for listening to the Special Fathers Network Dad to Dad Podcast. The Special Fathers Network is a dad to dad mentoring program for fathers raising children with special needs. Through our personalized matching process, new fathers with special needs children match up with mentor fathers in a similar situation. It’s a great way for dads to support other dads. To find out more, go to 21stCenturyDads.org.

David Hirsch: And if you’re [00:27:00] a dad looking for help or would like to offer help, we would be honored to have you join our closed Facebook group. Please go to Facebook.com, groups, and search “dad to dad.” Lastly, we’re always looking to share interesting stories. If you’d like to share your story or know of a compelling story, please send an email to David@ 21stCenturyDads.org.

Tom Couch: The Special Fathers Network Dad to Dad Podcast was produced by me, Tom Couch.

Thanks again to Horizon Therapeutics who believe that science and compassion must work together to transform lives. That’s why they work tirelessly to research, develop, and bring forward medicines for people living with rare and rheumatic diseases. Discover more about Horizon Therapeutics at HorizonTherapeutics.com.