302 – Gabe Perna of Newtown, CT An Award Winning Journalist, Digital Health Editor & Father Of Two Including One With Autism

Transcript:

Tom Couch: [00:00:00] Special thanks to Horizon Therapeutics for sponsoring the Special Fathers Network Dad to Dad Podcast, working tirelessly to research, develop, and bring forward medicines for people living with rare and rheumatic diseases. Discover more about Horizon Therapeutics mission at HorizonTherapeutics.com.

Gabe Perna: I think at the early stages, I would be like, he doesn’t have cancer. He doesn’t have some really bad disease. Yeah, that’s true. It could be worse. It could always be worse. But that doesn’t mean it’s not hard. That doesn’t mean when there’s a meltdown in the middle of Target or something, you can’t sit there and be like, wow, this kind of stinks and at least acknowledge how you’re feeling.

Tom Couch: That’s our guest this week, Gabe Perna, a digital journalist and father of two children including Spencer, 6, who’s autistic. We’ll hear Gabe’s story and we’ll hear some sage advice about parenting children who are autistic. That’s all on this Special Fathers Network Dad to Dad Podcast. Now say hello [00:01:00] to the founder of the Special Fathers Network and host of the Dad to Dad Podcast, David Hirsch.

David Hirsch: Hi, and thanks for listening to the Special Fathers Network Dad to Dad Podcast presented by the Special Fathers Network, a dad to dad mentoring program for fathers raising children with special needs.

David Hirsch: The Special Fathers Network MasterMind group experience is the most comprehensive program the 21st Century Dads Foundation offers. Dads raising children with special needs meet virtually on a weekly basis and form meaningful relationships while sharing weekly wins, discussing books, and sharing heartfelt challenges. One of the highlights of the year is attending an in-person weekend retreat. We’re launching 10 new MasterMind groups in 2024 with 10 dads per group. That means we’re only looking for 10 like-minded dads in each community. If you’re a dad raising a child with special needs, we hope you’ll join a local MasterMind group and make the investment to become the best version of yourself. For more information, please see the show notes or simply go to 21stCenturyDads.org.

Tom Couch: [00:02:00] Now let’s hear this conversation between Gabe Perna and David Hirsch.

David Hirsch: I’m thrilled to be talking today with Gabe Perna of Newtown, Connecticut, who is an award-winning journalist, a digital health editor with Modern Healthcare, and father of two boys including one with autism. Gabe, thank you for taking the time to do a podcast interview for the Special Fathers Network.

Gabe Perna: Yeah, absolutely. Happy to be here.

David Hirsch: You and your wife, Amanda, have been married for 10 years and are the proud parents of two children: Logan, 3, and Spencer, 6, who has autism. Let’s start with some background. Where did you grow up? Tell me something about your family.

Gabe Perna: I grew up in Dedham, Massachusetts, which is a suburb of Boston. I grew up with my parents, Mike and Marsha, and my sister, Lauren. I had a very nice childhood. A lot of good friends. A lot of my friends are the people that I grew up with, that I’ve known pretty much my whole life. My parents always supported us. It was a nice town. I would say a pretty [00:03:00] boring existence, fun and dealt with our own fair share of challenges and proud to be where I’m from and I always like going back.

David Hirsch: Excellent. So I’m curious to know, what does your dad do for a living?

Gabe Perna: He’s partly retired now, but when he was working he was a financial planner, helped manage investments for his clients. And he also did a lot of their tax work as well on the side. But yeah, his primary job for a long time was financial planner.

David Hirsch: Okay. Well, a man after my own heart.

Gabe Perna: Yeah, exactly.

David Hirsch: Because I started out as an auditor and tax accountant and I’ve been a financial advisor now for the better part of 40 years. So I imagine your dad and I could have a nice conversation.

Gabe Perna: Definitely.

David Hirsch: So I’m curious to know, how would you describe your relationship with your dad?

Gabe Perna: It’s a solid relationship. He’s always been the guy I looked up to. He’s guided me in so many ways. When I was growing up, he was there [00:04:00] and volunteered in a lot of my activities, supported me, helped me practice, get better at things that I needed to get better at.

Gabe Perna: When I went off to college, we still were in touch. I moved basically out of college into New York and I haven’t really lived in Boston in a while, but we still connect, obviously. Not as much as I’d like to, but we still connect and have all these deep conversations. He’s been very supportive. When Spencer was diagnosed with autism, he really dove into it and was able to really help me along the way and be there for me and understand that this was a little bit unusual and it was a unique challenge that we were all going to face as a family.

David Hirsch: Yeah, well thanks for sharing. What I think I heard you say was that he’s somebody that you’ve looked up to, you’ve got a good strong relationship with him, he was present, he was supportive. You know, what more could you ask really?

Gabe Perna: No. Yeah, he was great. He was a great dad. Great.

David Hirsch: So when you think about your dad were there a couple of things that come to mind? Oh yeah, these are my big takeaways from my relationship with my dad.

Gabe Perna: Yeah. He’s big into hard work. He always has been into work. And that’s why we joked when he semi-retired because he still works a [00:05:00] lot. And if he’s not working with his clients, he’s working in our yard. We always laughed. His hobby was yard work and he really took a lot of pride in keeping our yard looking good and having a garden and all that stuff. So he loves working. It’s in his blood. And I think the thing that I’ve always taken is there is just no substitute for hard work. It doesn’t matter how gifted, how talented, how maybe not gifted you are. I never always thought I was the smartest kid in school but I knew I’d work the hardest. I would do anything possible to make it. And I feel like I’ve taken that with him. I’ve been able to succeed in a field like journalism that, let’s face it, is a hard field to succeed in these days. And I attribute a lot of that to hard work and just hustling and being there and I think I take a lot of that from my dad.

David Hirsch: Yeah what I heard you say is that he’s got a great work ethic. And the idea that [00:06:00] comes to mind is rule number one is to work hard. Rule number two is to pay attention to rule number one.

Gabe Perna: Yeah, that’s right. That’s right.

David Hirsch: I’m thinking about other father figures now. And I’m wondering what, if any, influence your grandfathers had, starting on your dad’s side.

Gabe Perna: Yeah, my dad’s dad died when I was pretty young. I was, I think, eight. I knew him. I did not know him well. I did know him and I do have some fond memories of going to his house. He lived on a farm. He was a farmer. Again, hard work. That’s where that came from. ‘Cause my grandfather had three jobs when my dad was growing up and really worked hard to make sure my dad had a good life. But I do have fond memories of going to his farm. We were both into wrestling and sports and all the activities that I ended up growing up to love. So I think I took that from him.

Gabe Perna: On my mom’s side, my mom’s dad, he really was a great guy. We called him Poppy and he was [00:07:00] just a really unique soul. He ran a school for wayward teenagers, young adults. Kids who had gone off the beaten path. That was his baby. He’d started that. He was just a warm, loving figure. Just really made you happy to be around him and just always treated people so well. No one ever had a conversation with him that they’ve ended up feeling worse after they had that conversation. That’s the way he lived his life. And I’ve always taken… It’s hard to live up to that, but I’ve always tried to take that. Always try to leave a good impression on someone. I always try to make them feel better. Obviously it’s not going to work for everyone, just try to be as nice as possible.

David Hirsch: Yeah thanks for sharing. It sounds like your maternal grandfather was quite a caring person. You mentioned he worked with troubled teens. Most parents can’t wait to get their kids through the teenage phase and then not look back. So the fact that he made himself [00:08:00] available to and had a heart for that just speaks volumes about the type of person he is.

Gabe Perna: Yeah.

David Hirsch: Any other men, in addition to your dad and your grandfathers, that played an influential role in your life when you were growing up?

Gabe Perna: Yeah, I had teachers and counselors along the way who I always thought of. I think the one that always sticks out is my fourth grade teacher, Mr. DZ. Mr. DZ was like a funny guy and really every kid liked him. But one of the reasons he got along with me so well is we were both big sports fanatics. And he actually, on top of being a fourth grade teacher, did some stringing work for the Brockton Enterprise in Massachusetts. And later on, when I was in like seventh grade, I had to shadow someone at their job and I ended up picking Mr. DZ, not for his role as a teacher but for his role as a sports writer. And I always thought that was pretty cool. He had an autograph from Carl Yastrzemski, if you know who that [00:09:00] is. He ended up giving me Carl Yastrzemski’s autograph. He just supported me a lot. All these years I’ve been meaning to reach out and just tell him how much I appreciate he really believed in me. I feel like it’s easy to remember the people who don’t believe in you. It’s easy to carry a chip on your shoulder when someone doubts you. Believe me, I’ve had plenty of that. It’s more important I think just remember those people who have always said yeah, you got it and supported you. And he was one of the first I can remember outside of my family

David Hirsch: Yeah thanks for sharing. He sounds like an influential person. He made a strong first impression on you as a young guy. And you did follow into those footsteps with the journalism career.

Gabe Perna: Yeah.

David Hirsch: I think that if you haven’t reached out to him, maybe you can use this episode, when it gets published, to share it with him. Yeah.

Gabe Perna: Yeah.

David Hirsch: That would be a natural thing.

Gabe Perna: Yeah, definitely. Definitely.

David Hirsch: So my recollection was you went to Marist College, you got a degree in journalism. And I’m wondering, where did your [00:10:00] career take you?

Gabe Perna: I’ve been to a few stops, so I won’t go into the nitty gritty of each stop. What I’ll say is I moved after college, I was in Boston for a year or two and I realized I got to be in New York. That’s where the action is and that’s where I’m going to have a career here. So I moved to New York. Really it was New Jersey, but I like to just say New York. I think it’s a little more romantic than saying I moved to New Jersey. But I was in New York, I worked for a daily online paper called the International Business Times, where I wrote about technology and consumer technology, specifically. TVs and the latest going on in consumer tech. And to be honest, I didn’t really appreciate it that much. There’s just something about it that felt very hollow. Oh, cool. Like a new TV is out. So I ended up leaving and got a job writing about healthcare technology. And I was a little skeptical, but I was [00:11:00] also desperate. So I was like, all right, let’s just see how it goes and if it doesn’t work out, I can go somewhere else. But I ended up really liking it. And when I got there, it was like another language to me, but within months I had realized I had picked up the language and was able to talk.

Gabe Perna: And this was at a time when Obamacare had just passed and there was just so much going on with the Supreme Court and there was just a lot going on with healthcare in the country. And it was an interesting time to be covering and following the industry. I’ve had some good bosses and had some good colleagues. So I’ve been lucky to be able to cover it.

David Hirsch: Thanks for sharing. So I’m curious to know in your current role as a digital health editor, what is it that you do at Modern Healthcare?

Gabe Perna: Mostly write and edit and just help publish. It’s a daily publication. We produce so many articles every day. And yeah, I just try to write what’s happening in the world of digital health. And I work with another [00:12:00] colleague who’s great, and I edit his work. And we brainstorm together, along with my editor, about the stories that we need to cover that are pertinent to our audience. And yeah, just writing, editing, and all sorts of fun stuff.

David Hirsch: Excellent. Thanks for sharing. So I’m curious to know, how did you and Amanda meet?

Gabe Perna: We met at a party in Hell’s Kitchen. I had gone to college at Marist with this guy, and she had known him through a couple of her friends at Syracuse. And at that time, I was still in that first job when I moved to New York, which I didn’t really like and I wasn’t so happy there and I didn’t have a girlfriend or anything. I was like down in the dumps and I ended up going to this party, even though I hadn’t seen the guy in a while. I said, what do I have to lose? So I went to it and I think we talked very early on in the party and before you know it an hour or two had passed and we had a good time.

Gabe Perna: I think we joke [00:13:00] now ’cause I was like, I’ll call you, I’ll call you tomorrow. I’ll call you tomorrow. And then I didn’t because I was like, I don’t want to seem too desperate. [David laughs] So I think I waited for a third day. We ended up meeting up a few weeks later and off to the races. And I knew pretty early on I wanted to marry her and be with her for the rest of my life. It was, I’m not saying love at first sight, but it was very early on where I knew we would be together.

David Hirsch: I love the story. Thanks for your authenticity and transparency. So let’s talk about special needs. I’m curious to know, prior to becoming parents, did you or Amanda have any connection to the disability or special needs community?

Gabe Perna: A little bit. My wife’s a school psychologist, so she interacts with kids with autism and ADHD and different special needs pretty much every day. And up until this year, she was working in schools, elementary schools. She was dealing with kids like Spencer’s age. And I had my mom’s uncle, who had special [00:14:00] needs and was in a home. Obviously there was kids in my school growing up, kids in camp growing up. So I was not sheltered and obviously I had connections as did she, but definitely not to the level like we would have when our son was diagnosed with autism.

David Hirsch: So what is Spencer’s diagnosis and how did it come about?

Gabe Perna: Yeah, he’s diagnosed with ASD. He also has been diagnosed with ADHD and there might be some other things in there too, to be honest. But he’s only six, so we got some time. But yeah, ASD is obviously the big one. And it’s an interesting story, David. Very early on, my wife knew what the signs were and figured it out. But I was a little more in denial and I saw some things, but I think I just made excuses for them. And even explicitly said, I don’t want to say the “A” word because I don’t think that’s what it is. And it’s a label that you [00:15:00] won’t ever shed. I don’t know. Over time, I think we both kind of…it just became hard to deny. It got harder and harder. He would have these meltdowns and just have these moments, and other kids his age were starting to communicate in the typical way. He was not and it just became obvious. And then, by the time right before his third birthday, he was in preschool, in the town preschool, for everything, OT, PT, speech, etc. And they right before his third birthday, were like, yeah, he’s showing signs of autism. And I think he got diagnosed right around his third birthday.

David Hirsch: Yeah. Thanks for sharing. And I really appreciate your openness and authenticity. It’s usually the mom that is a little bit more in tune with what’s going on on a day to day basis. And obviously Amanda, with the work that she does, is more well-informed than the average young mom. And it’s not uncommon for dads to, if not be in outright denial, say something along the lines of, oh let’s cross [00:16:00] that bridge when we get there. Or, sometimes boys can be a little bit slower, let’s be patient. Let’s not pre-worry our worries. By the way, these are all things that I remember saying as a young dad.

Gabe Perna: Right?

David Hirsch: It’s not like I just heard those things. I must’ve said those things hundreds of times. And in many cases, a lot of things that we worry about never come to pass, right? You were spending a lot of time and energy on things that never came to be.

David Hirsch: But you also touched on something I think is super important. And I don’t mean to be judgmental but I think a lot of parents are concerned about labels, right? I don’t want my kid to have that label, right? It’s a little bit of a form of denial, but there’s something important about the label, right? There’s pros and cons. It’s not all good. It’s not all bad.

Gabe Perna: Yeah.

David Hirsch: At least in the world of health care – something that you understand better than the average person – that diagnosis provides you with access to resources and reimbursement that you wouldn’t otherwise have. And unless you’re super wealthy and you’re like, hey, I’m paying for all this [00:17:00] stuff myself anyway…

Gabe Perna: Yeah.

David Hirsch: …the label actually is a tool for getting resources. And I don’t think you want to be short-sighted about that. You need to embrace it for what it is, move on, get over it because it doesn’t mean anything to your kid that kid has the label. It’s really something in the parents minds. So anyway, I really appreciate you being so open about that.

David Hirsch: So anyway, you get the diagnosis around age three and I’m wondering, what was going through your mind? What was going through Amanda’s mind? Were there any fears that you can recall just a few years ago now?

Gabe Perna: Oh yeah, for sure. One of the things that I look back on at that time in horror almost, it’s just like, I had accepted that he had autism, but I was still in denial in a lot of ways. In denial about what it would mean and what his place would be and being realistic. In my head, I was like, all right, he has autism. It’s not going to change a lot. [00:18:00] Truthfully over time, reality started to chip away at that. He was put in a special program at his school and he still interacts with neurotypical kids, but… And it has been okay to a degree, but I’ve had to reset my expectations and almost take it if not a day at a time, at least a month at a time, and just understand there’s going to be backslides. There’s going to be times where you think things are good, and then it’s going to seem like what happened? It’s not on him. It’s not oh what did he do wrong? What did we do wrong? It’s just how it is. That’s just what ASD is, I think. There’s a lot of mysteries. I think back then, I was unaware of what it would mean. But the flip side of that is there were things back then that I was dreading, that now I feel like I was silly for dreading.

Gabe Perna: In both cases, I just didn’t know as much back then and I wasn’t as comfortable with it. I wouldn’t even say to people, he has [00:19:00] autism. Now I do, and I have no problem telling people what he has. I just didn’t know what I didn’t know. And that was partly because I didn’t really want to hear it. I just had for a year or two kind of said, it’s not autism. It’s not autism. And so like, it just became undeniable to me.

David Hirsch: I’m glad to hear that you’ve embraced it and by talking about it you realize that there’s a lot of other people out there that are in similar situations, right? And then you’re building community and you’re getting to know people on a deeper level. And it’s something that you can relate to, other people can relate to, and it’s a shared experience. And at the beginning, it might seem like a Debbie Downer or it’s a negative. But as you get into it, not just for days or weeks or months, but years and maybe decades if you can look into the future, just part of who Spencer is.

Gabe Perna: Yeah.

David Hirsch: It’s not like it’s a disease and you’re going to cure him of it.

Gabe Perna: No.

David Hirsch: Some people have that mentality. It’s just an aspect of his [00:20:00] personality. If you understand what the triggers are and you can see the storms brewing and you can nip those situations in the bud, prevent the meltdowns, prevent those moments, you’re going to help preserve his humanity and make life a lot easier for everybody involved. So it does take a little bit of a heightened level of awareness and heightened level of engagement. But there are certainly a lot of rewards that go along with it as well.

Tom Couch: We’ll be back with more of the conversation on the Special Fathers Network Dad to Dad Podcast in just a few moments. But first, this quick message. Please help 21st Century Dads gather research on families raising children with special needs by having them complete the Special Fathers Network Early Intervention Parents Survey. A link to the survey can be found in the show notes. As a token of our appreciation, each person, mom or dad, who completes the survey will receive a Great Dad Coin. Thank you. Now, back to the conversation.

David Hirsch: I know it’s [00:21:00] relatively early on – he’s only been diagnosed three years ago – but has there been some advice that you can reflect on that you’ve gotten from others that’s been useful for you?

Gabe Perna: One of the most important things that I’ve heard and I remember my mom saying this to me, my boss, and it stuck with me. It’s just this element that you are your child’s biggest advocate. And that’s obviously not really exclusive to special needs, but it’s very important in the world of special needs. I think a lot of the first three years of this, almost four now, is like spending time in these meetings, these IEP meetings, and these different conversations, sometimes it’s just hard not to take things personally. And obviously I don’t think anyone means to be personal but like when they talk about your child like he or she’s like a lab rat almost, you get a little defensive. Hey, that’s my [00:22:00] kid you’re talking about. I’ve tried to push back, not in a confrontational way, but just if I feel like he needs me as just dad, then I have to push back. And I feel like that’s something that I’ve taken with me in a lot of these things.

Gabe Perna: The other thing that I’ve heard, is it’s okay to feel bad for yourself and you don’t have to give a perspective. I think at the early stages, I would be like, he doesn’t have cancer. He doesn’t have some really bad disease. Yeah, that’s true. It could be worse. It could always be worse, but that doesn’t mean it’s not hard. That doesn’t mean when there’s a meltdown in the middle of Target or something, you can’t sit there and be like, wow, this kind of stinks and at least acknowledge how you’re feeling. So that’s another one that I’ve heard. And that’s a shout out to my therapist. That’s been one of the things that she’s worked on with me is to acknowledge that I’m allowed to feel bad at times.

David Hirsch: [00:23:00] Yeah, two really good points. The first is that you know your child better than anybody else And you do need to advocate. And that’s not, like you said, just with a child with special needs. It could be with typical kids as well. And remember typical kids have meltdowns too.

Gabe Perna: Yeah.

David Hirsch: It’s not always the autism, right? It’s just sometimes it’s the age. And then give yourself some grace. That’s what I heard you saying, right?

Gabe Perna: Yeah.

David Hirsch: We’re not always on the top of our game. Our bucket’s not always full. Sometimes we’re totally drained. Maybe you just haven’t gotten sleep for an extended period of time, stuff going on at work, maybe something going on between you and your spouse. All these things pile up and it can be draining. Just cutting yourself some slack I think is a really healthy thing to contemplate as well. And not to focus on the negative, but what have been some of the bigger challenges that you’ve faced as it relates to the autism diagnosis?

Gabe Perna: I think the biggest one is the one that everyone talks about, which is mourning that life that you thought you were going to have. That’s really a tough one, [00:24:00] especially in these earlier years, I think. Get back to me in seven or eight years. But I do think once kids reach teenage years, they drift apart from you anyway. But when they’re this age and I’m starting to see with my other son who’s neurotypical is there’s a lot of moments that you don’t really get with an autistic child. They’re just connection moments. They still come. Don’t get me wrong. We still have some great moments where we connect, but it’s just not as easy. And you might think you have some event or some kind of cool experience. Like he joined the Boy Scouts and I thought this will be a fun thing for him and I to do together. And it didn’t really work out. It just wasn’t what I expected and wasn’t something he enjoyed. And those are the times where it’s tough because you see other dads with other kids and you think why can’t that be me. So yeah that’s probably the toughest.

David Hirsch: Yeah, it’s hard not to compare one child to another, [00:25:00] right? Because you have more than one child.

Gabe Perna: Yeah.

David Hirsch: And it’s really hard not to compare your situation to a neighbor or a friend or classmate situation because they have kids that are pretty much the exact same age. And there’s a phrase, you’ve probably heard it before, that comparison is the thief of joy.

Gabe Perna: Yeah.

David Hirsch: And that applies to all aspects of our lives, right? That’s like a keeping up with the joneses type of thing.

Gabe Perna: Yeah.

David Hirsch: You know if your neighbor gets a new car or does this or does that, it’s typical, it’s natural to compare yourself to others. So I think that extra discipline that you have to exercise, that goes along with having a kid on the spectrum is gonna be a healthy thing for both you and Amanda. So I’m curious to know what impact Spencer’s situation’s had, first on your marriage and then second on your extended family.

Gabe Perna: On the first one, I think it’s just brought us closer together and I think there’s an acknowledgement that only me and her really [00:26:00] understand what’s truly going on. And I think people get glimpses and snippets of it and they mean well. But it’s just, unless you’re living in it, you just can’t quite understand how hard it can be and some of the daily challenges that I can hear going on behind me as we talk. That’s the kind of stuff that really drains you and I think we’ve been a good support for each other. When she’s up, I’m down; when I’m down, she’s up. And just being able to center each other out a little bit. It can do two things. It can probably draw you farther apart and I think it could draw you closer. And I think we’ve just been closer. It’s stressful. Don’t get me wrong. There’s a lot of stressful days, but I think ultimately it’s just helped us be closer and understand each other and help us grow as individuals and as a couple.

Gabe Perna: In terms of extended family, everyone has tried and everyone is super [00:27:00] understanding. Again, I don’t think you can really understand it unless you’re in it. But I do appreciate… everyone’s put effort and they’re super understanding. It’s funny. Spencer can be like a funny kid and it’s just funny to watch people react to him. And again, if you’re not in it, it might seem unexpected. My parents, Amanda’s parents, our siblings, they’ve all been great and they’ve all tried to help us out and really just unconditional love for Spencer and helped raise him.

David Hirsch: I’m really pleased to hear that. Thanks for sharing. So I’m thinking about supporting organizations and I’m wondering have there been any organizations that you’ve been able to plug into the last few years that have helped either Spencer directly or been of help to your family?

Gabe Perna: Yeah. One I want to give a shout out to is Families United in Newtown. They’re a local group. They do a lot of good work. They do a lot of events for kids with special needs. They have something at Christmas, they have something at Easter, they have something at Halloween, et cetera, et [00:28:00] cetera, just like gatherings. It’s a good chance for parents to meet and talk about things and give kids a safe space to hang out. So I appreciate all the work that they do. My wife’s involved with that.

Gabe Perna: There’s other groups too in town. We have a very cool kids museum here, Ever Wonder, that they do a lot of stuff and have helped us out with a lot of different activities. But it’s nice to get support and just have activities.

David Hirsch: I want to share a little story with you and it had to do with me getting schooled or getting a little education about this. I’m interviewing a guy. This is no exaggeration, episode seven, right? Your episode is going to be like 300 and something, right? So hundreds of episodes ago early on. So I was a little bit more green than I am today. And this guy had started an organization out in Southern California and it’s called Angel City Sports, and they put on these Angel City games. And he has a kid with a physical [00:29:00] disability; he was born without part of his lower leg and only a finger, one digit on his hand, had to go through a bunch of surgeries, amputation, all that. Anyway, the kid’s a little bit of a rockstar, as it relates to athletics. As he’s describing and he’s so enthusiastic and they’ve got dozens and dozens if not hundreds of people involved in this program out in Southern California, I said, “Clayton, with all due respect, why would you create an organization to compete with Special Olympics?” I just happened to know that Special Olympics Southern California has like 30,000 families. And he goes, very politely, he said, “Well, as you know, Special Olympics is for people with intellectual disabilities. What we’ve been talking about is people with physical disabilities.”

Gabe Perna: Wow. Yeah.

David Hirsch: And I’m like, Oh. Oh yeah, that makes sense.

Gabe Perna: Ha. That’s funny.

David Hirsch: I don’t think everybody knows what all these organizations do.

Gabe Perna: No.

David Hirsch: So anyway, I share that with you in a lighthearted way to poke fun at myself, which is to say, there’s a lot of really positive things that are going on in communities all [00:30:00] over the country.

Gabe Perna: Yeah.

David Hirsch: And if the opportunity presents itself, because it’s not just basketball and soccer and things like that. They do things like bowling and things that kids don’t think of as sports…

Gabe Perna: Cool.

David Hirsch: …but just fun activities. So anyway like you said, you’re just at the beginning of the journey. So I’m thinking about advice now, advice that you might be giving as a young dad. I know it’s pretty early, but what are the thoughts that come to mind? What advice would you give to a dad who might be even younger than yourself? Put yourself back three years ago, what would you share with your younger self?

Gabe Perna: I think it goes back to what I said. It’s okay to feel bad and it’s okay to be sad. It doesn’t mean you don’t love your child. I love my son and I would do anything for him. And that is the truth. We gave him therapeutic horseback lessons because he loves it. You do anything for your child. Doesn’t mean you can’t at least acknowledge hey, this is pretty hard. It’s not easy. And it’s [00:31:00] okay to understand that. And it doesn’t mean you’re disparaging your kid. It doesn’t mean there’s someone out there who has it a lot harder than you. Yes, that’s 100 percent true. But there’s also a lot of people who have it easier. And you just have to acknowledge how you’re feeling. To your point, don’t worry about what other people are doing. Don’t worry about who has it worse; don’t worry about who has it better. Just worry about how you’re feeling and acknowledge and take care of yourself because you need to be at a hundred percent. That’s true for parenting I think in general. I don’t think that it’s just special needs parenting, but you need to be a hundred percent. You can’t just half ass it. And so you have to acknowledge when it’s hard and when you need a moment to do whatever. Go outside and do the lawn or, I like going kayaking or doing something for yourself.

David Hirsch: Yeah, good advice. I think what you’re touching on a little bit is the importance of personal care.

Gabe Perna: Yeah.

David Hirsch: You need to take care of yourself physically, mentally, emotionally. [00:32:00] And if you’re going to bring your A game more consistently you need to be fit.

Gabe Perna: Yeah.

David Hirsch: Physically, mentally, and emotionally fit. And it’s okay to take some time for yourself and not feel guilty…

Gabe Perna: Yeah.

David Hirsch: …that you’re not putting a hundred percent of your time into your relationship with your spouse or doing things a hundred percent for others, including your kids.

Gabe Perna: Yeah.

David Hirsch: So anyway quite insightful for such a young guy like yourself.

Gabe Perna: Thanks.

David Hirsch: So is there anything else you’d like to say before we wrap up?

Gabe Perna: No, I just love my son and any complaints that I have, I think bombarded by how much time we spend together and how much I love being with him and exploring the world through his eyes. And with his brother, I think one thing that can be a little hard that maybe your listeners can relate to is like when you have a sibling, especially if that sibling is neurotypical or doesn’t have that challenge, one thing that I – it’s early and the sibling is younger – but one thing that I try to do is make [00:33:00] sure that not all our time is spent focused on Spencer. Because he does take up a good amount of time with his special needs, but that doesn’t mean you can just forget about your second child. Not forget, but it’s easy to overshadow, I think, and I have a lot of great times with my younger son, too, and don’t want him to get overshadowed.

David Hirsch: Yeah you raise another good point, which I think of as the issue of siblings and family balance, which is if you do have a child that’s atypical, they would oftentimes require more of your time and your resources. And if you’re not cognizant of that, you’re not doing something to compensate for it, you could wake up not just weeks or months later, but years or decades later and say, oh my gosh, I was so focused on so-and-so at the detriment of my other child or children. So anyway, just the fact that it’s top of mind for you demonstrates that you’re going to hopefully stay on top of that as well.

David Hirsch: So if somebody wants to learn more about your work or to contact you, what’s the best way to [00:34:00] do that?

Gabe Perna: You can hit me up at Gabriel.Perna@ModernHealthcare.com. That’s my work email. If it’s a work question, I can answer it there. Otherwise, I can find a better way of contacting you, but it’s an easy one to remember. Gabriel.Perna@ModernHealthcare.com. If you look at ModernHealthcare.com, a lot of my writing’s on there. I’m also on Twitter @ Gabrielle SPerna, so see some of my stuff there or hit me up on LinkedIn. Always happy to chat. Always love chatting with other folks in the same situation and it’s good to rant sometimes and it’s good to just get things off your chest. Yeah, happy to do that.

David Hirsch: I’ll be sure to include that information in the show notes so it’ll make it as easy as possible for somebody to follow up with you. Gabe, thank you for your time and many insights. As a reminder, Gabe is just one of the dads who’s part of the Special Fathers Network, a mentoring program for fathers raising a child with special needs. If you’d like to be a mentor father or [00:35:00] are seeking advice from a mentor father with a similar situation to your own, please go to 21stCenturyDads.org.

David Hirsch: Thank you for listening to the latest episode of the Special Fathers Network Dad to Dad Podcast. I hope you enjoyed the conversation as much as I did. As you probably know, the 21st Century Dads Foundation is a 501c3 not for profit organization, which means we need your help to keep our content free to all concerned. Would you please consider making a tax-deductible contribution? I would really appreciate your support. Gabe, thanks again.

Gabe Perna: Thank you so much, David.

Tom Couch: And thank you for listening to the Special Fathers Network Dad to Dad Podcast. The Special Fathers Network is a dad to dad mentoring program for fathers raising children with special needs. Through our personalized matching process, new fathers with special needs children match up with mentor fathers in a similar situation. It’s a great way for dads to support other dads. To find out more, go to 21stCenturyDads.org.

David Hirsch: And if you’re a dad looking for help or [00:36:00] would like to offer help, we would be honored to have you join our closed Facebook group. Please go to Facebook.com, groups, and search “dad to dad.” Lastly, we’re always looking to share interesting stories. If you’d like to share your story or know of a compelling story, please send an email to David@ 21stCenturyDads.org.

Tom Couch: The Special Fathers Network Dad to Dad Podcast was produced by me, Tom Couch.

Tom Couch: Thanks again to Horizon Therapeutics, who believe that science and compassion must work together. That’s why they work tirelessly to research, develop, and bring forward medicines for people living with rare and rheumatic diseases. Discover more about Horizon Therapeutics at HorizonTherapeutics.com.