012 – Shanne Sowards, a Former Teen Father, Steps up to Raise His Daughter & Mentor Teen Fathers

Transcript:

 Tom Couch: This is the Special Fathers Network Podcast. The Special Fathers Network is a dad to dad mentoring program for fathers raising children with special needs. Through our personalized matching process, new fathers with special needs children connect with mentor fathers in a similar situation. It’s a great way for fathers to support fathers.

Sometimes the mentor father is just there to answer a few questions. Sometimes they become good friends. It’s a proven support system for new fathers with special needs kids. If you’re a father looking for support, or if you’re a dad who’d like to offer support, go to 21stcenturydads.org.

David Hirsch: Hi, I’m David Hirsch. This is the Special Fathers Network Podcast, stories of fathers helping fathers.

Tom Couch: And I’m Tom Couch. Today David talks to a special father who’s making a difference in Portland, Oregon. His name is Shanne Sowards, who at the age of 15 became a father to his daughter, Kendra.

Shanne Sowards: Two 15 year old kids alone. Most of the time that adds up to a baby.

Tom Couch: While the relationship with the mother didn’t work out and against the odds, Shanne stuck by Kendra.

Shanne Sowards: My promise, because my mom left Zoe when I was so young, was I was never going to leave my child

Tom Couch: With the help of a mentor named Ben, Shanne was able to make more of the right decisions.

Shanne Sowards: And it was great. Before Ben even encouraged me to make any changes, I think it was the first time in a long time, I actually had support.

Tom Couch: Now at the age of 40, Shanne is happily married and is the father of three daughters.

Shanne Sowards: And this billboard had been there for months and months and months when it just said “Mentoring” in red and white letters on it.

Tom Couch: Not so long ago, and with very limited resources, Shanne felt the calling to inspire young dads and started Squires, a mentoring program for teen fathers. Today he’s mentored dozens of teen fathers in and around Portland, Oregon.

Shanne Sowards: If you put the best interest of your child first, you’re never wrong.

Tom Couch: Today, David will also be talking with one of Shanne’s mentees, Quame, who at 16 became a teen father to his son, King.

Quame: I started taking my son out for the first time by myself, with all the medical condition, all the equipment, and I felt so proud of myself. So like a father. So, this is what it feels like.

Tom Couch: King has had some serious health issues, and it’s inspiring to hear this young father’s devotion to his child.

Quame: It’s so wonderful what Shanne did. It changed my life.

Tom Couch: So let’s get to it. Here’s David Hirsch’s interview with Shanne Sowards and Quame Assumen.

David Hirsch: So I’m with Shanne Soward’s and Quame Assumen, and we’re going to talk about the Squires program. Shanne, thanks for doing a podcast interview for the Special Fathers Network.

Shanne Sowards: My pleasure.

David Hirsch: So as a little background, Shanne is 40 years old. He has three daughters. The oldest is 25, so he became a father at age 15. And he started a program four or five years ago called the Squires program, which is a program for super young dads, teen dads. So let’s start with some background. Where did you grow up?

Shanne Sowards: I grew up here in Portland, Oregon, actually a small town called Canby. I bounced around back and forth between Milwaukie and Canby, actually. I lived with my grandma, and I lived with my dad, just back and forth a lot. My mom left when I was 17 months old, so it was just me and my dad most of the time.

And we would live in Canby, and then things would get where he just couldn’t provide, so he would send me to my grandma’s house and I would live there.

David Hirsch: And this would have been his mom,

Shanne Sowards: Actually, it was my mom’s mom.

David Hirsch: Really?

Shanne Sowards: Yeah.

David Hirsch: Tell me something about that.

Shanne Sowards: My grandma was the greatest woman I’ve ever met in my life. Like I can’t even put into words. And she understands. So my grandma was my mom, but I didn’t know that’s what moms did. I thought that was what grandmas did. And she took school clothes shopping. She’d volunteer at PTA. She would just do all of those things. She would always fill that gap. But I just thought that’s what grandmas did. Now that she’s gone, I look back, and I see my wife do what my grandmother did. I’m like, “Oh, that’s what moms do.”

David Hirsch: Well, you didn’t know your mom, because she left when you were 17. Did you have any contact with your mom subsequently or not?

Shanne Sowards: I saw my mom about once or twice a year, growing up, and it was this really weird conversation. We didn’t really know each other very well. She had this guy that she married, and they had a bunch of kids.

So in my mind, she’d actually run away to go have another family. She had two sons and a daughter with this other guy. I always tell people I have mommy issues. I’m like, why didn’t she want me? Why did she choose that family over me? So I was super wounded by that. I actually feel like that part of my story of being a teen father is because I was so hungry for the affection of a woman that I was trying to replace that.

David Hirsch: Got it. So how would you characterize your relationship with your dad? When you think about your dad, what stands out? What are some of your strongest memories?

Shanne Sowards: It’s a weird kind of conversation, because my father is manic depressive and hypoglycemic, so he would have sugar and then he would crash, and then he’d have a manic episode where he would just rage.

So there’s a lot of weird pieces to our relationship. And it wasn’t until I was 17 that that all came to light, that’s what was going on. So it was just these weird things. However, I also just thought that was normal. I thought that’s how dads were. What stands out to me about my father, though, is that he stayed. Even when he couldn’t provide for me, he made sure I was provided for.

He would swallow that pill that I know it killed him to do and take me to…I mean, it wasn’t even his mom. So the woman who left him high and dry, he would take me to her mom and allow me to live there for six months to a year, and then he would get on his feet, and he would come and get me. And so those are the things that really stand out to me, is that he just did the best he could, I think.

David Hirsch: You’re an only child?

Shanne Sowards: No. Actually, I have to think about that. So between my parents, yes. But then he remarried a woman that had a son.

David Hirsch: So you have a half brother?

Shanne Sowards: He’s a stepbrother, and then I have a half brother and sister from that man.

David Hirsch: Got it. Sorry. So, just one more question about your grandmother relationship. Because it does seem a little odd that your dad chose to take you to your mom’s mom as opposed to his own mom. Was there a reason for that?

Shanne Sowards: I don’t exactly know. Well, there’s some legendary stories in my family. But I think it started just because that’s how my mom did it. This legend goes that my mom and dad took a nap. And then when the three of us took a nap. And then she woke up and brought me over to my grandmother’s house, and said, “Mom, can you watch Shanne?” And Grandma was like, “Of course.” And she didn’t say for how long or anything.

Then she disappeared, and nobody heard from her for like three, four weeks, something like that. She just disappeared off the face of the earth. And my dad, while he went looking for her, he let me stay there. And that just kind of built that relationship. And my grandmother—there was no way she was going to allow me not to be in her life.

I was her second grandchild. I think that’s kind of what started it. And there’s also a legend that my mother actually told my dad’s mom, “Stay away. He has a grandma. You don’t need to be around.” Whether or not that’s true, I have no idea. But that’s the legendary story.

David Hirsch: Okay. So let’s talk about grandpas for a moment. Your dad’s dad and your mom’s dad. What type of relationship, if any, do you have with those two?

Shanne Sowards: So my dad’s dad, we had a relationship. I mean, I saw him like two, three times a year maybe. They were steady. They were just kind of there. I didn’t see him much. Where my grandfather, my mom’s dad, Tom, I mean, we went fishing. Instead of going to church, we went fishing. He took me hunting, and he taught me all these things, when I lived with them. And even when I didn’t live with them for six months, I was probably there 10 to 15 weekends. So I was like every other weekend at Grandma and Grandpa’s, because that’s where I wanted to be.

David Hirsch: Okay. So you had a strong relationship with not only your grandmother, but your grandfather on your mom’s side.

Shanne Sowards: Yeah. They just they loved me as if I was their child, not just their grandchild. I think Grandpa didn’t try to play a role of a father or anything. He was Grandpa, and he was great. He was awesome.

David Hirsch: Excellent. So let’s just wrap up the part about your dad and your grandpas. If you had to identify one thing that your dad and each of your grandpas taught you, what would it be for each of them?

Shanne Sowards: My mom’s dad, Tom, he loved his country. He fought in the Korean war. I can hear him, like when he’d get upset with people. He loved to use the word “feller.” “Listen, feller!” And I just loved it. He was just steady. He was solid. You knew where you stood with Grandpa at all times. I think everyone knew, even if he didn’t like you. He never turned his family away. And my mom would roll into town, and they would stay for a few days, and I would get to see her, and they would give her some money, and then she’d be off to do whatever.

But he was just steady, solid. I don’t know if I can remember him saying, “I love you,” but I knew it. If that makes any sense.

David Hirsch: So by his example, as opposed to his word.

Shanne Sowards: Yeah.

David Hirsch: That’s excellent. So you had to identify one thing that you learned from your dad, either by his example, or by his word, what was the best takeaway?

Shanne Sowards: I think…it’s really hard. He is loyal to a fault, and that’s the hard part. Like, he’s so loyal, but it would go too far. So to a fault. That’s from his wives to his employers. He worked on it. And his chivalry towards women is some of the most outstanding I’ve ever seen. Like I’ve never seen a man defend a woman who was so wrong, so deeply. Like the whole world could see that she was wrong and there was no way. Like, “That’s a discussion that she and I will have later at a different time,” or, “You do not even look cross-eyed at my wife.”

David Hirsch: Wow. That’s impressive.

Shanne Sowards: It’s cool. But like I said, it was to a fault.

David Hirsch: Yeah. Well, one of the ethical dilemmas, paradigms, is this concept of truth versus loyalty. And it’s not a right or wrong. There is right or wrong in the world, but when somebody is so one-sided, sometimes they can’t see the truth. Or they don’t want to acknowledge the truth because they’re so loyal. And sometimes the truth hurts, and it’s not the right thing to emphasize. Loyalty is more important. And it’s not right or wrong, but that’s the point you’re making, which is he was loyal to a fault. He was on that spectrum of truth versus loyalty always over on the loyal side.

Shanne Sowards: Exactly.

David Hirsch: Okay, good. So we’re going to talk about teen parenting, initially on a personal level, you becoming a teen father, and then we’ll talk about the Squires program, the program that you started five years ago.

So tell me what the circumstances were that led to you becoming a father at age 15?

Shanne Sowards: So my girlfriend…

David Hirsch: You’re in high school together.

Shanne Sowards: We’re in high school together, and she runs away from her parents, her mom’s house. And so I asked my dad if she can stay, and he says yes. So she lives with us for the summer. And well, two 15 year old kids alone most of the time, you know, that adds up to a baby. It was a fun summer, and a summer with results.

David Hirsch: Documentation, if you will.

Shanne Sowards: Yeah. Documentation. I mean, that’s the gist of it. That’s what led up to it. I believe the reason why she left her mom’s house is because her mom found out that her daughter and I were being intimate, and that caused a big blow up. And Wendy said, “Nope, I’m out.”

David Hirsch: So her parents were probably trying to show her some tough love, and it just didn’t work. And she’s like, “I’m out of here.”

Shanne Sowards: Yeah.

David Hirsch: So you became parents at 15. What was the next year or next two years like?

Shanne Sowards: Well, while she was pregnant, I just kind of was there. I was 15. I couldn’t get a job. Even though everyone’s telling me you need to work, you need to work, you need to work. I couldn’t get a job because I was only 15. And the pregnancy, I mean, I went to appointments and everything. She had ended up moving out, living with her dad, and then living with another agency, and then moving back in with her mom.

You know you make this promise to yourself when you’re very young, like, I’m never going to use drugs, I’m never going to abuse women, or whatever. My promise, because my mom left when I was so young, was I was never going to leave my child. So I was going through the motions and not really knowing how to do this, and nobody’s really coaching me. And then Kendra was born, she was born in April. I got a job in July, because I turned 16

A few months later, I think it was after school started, I actually broke up with Wendy because, well, if I’m honest, because I was selfish. I was having a normal high school experience when she was not. She was going to alternative schools and things like that, and I was just having a normal high school experience. And girls thought it was great that I was an involved dad and I was getting all this attention. And there was this girl at work who was a little bit older…

I ended my relationship with her for selfish reasons, which was really, really hard for me because growing up in the poor neighborhoods that I grew up in, when I lived with my dad, I never saw dads being involved. Like my friends never went away to their dad’s house for the weekend. Because they were all just single moms. And my dad was only single dad in the neighborhood. And once in a while they would go away, but not very often. So I just really didn’t know what that looked like. So I felt like I was breaking up with my daughter, which was weird.

David Hirsch: So who had the baby then when you broke up?

Shanne Sowards: Wendy had the baby. She lived with her mom at the time, and then I would see her. I don’t even remember a lot of how things transpired. Eventually she ended up getting a house. Her dad bought a house or something. She was living in a house that her dad was kind of renting back to her. During this time, my parents had become homeless, so I was couch surfing myself, and I was working 40 hours a week, and I was paying child support. I’d pay whoever I was staying with some money so I can sleep on their couch.

But most of those places that I’d stay wasn’t a safe place to bring Kendra. So I literally would see her like every two weeks on payday, that was consistent. And then maybe a little bit more, if time permitted, or if I was…I mean, I can make up all sorts of excuses. I didn’t see her enough.

David Hirsch: So how many years was that that you were working and supporting her that weren’t really actively involved with her life?

Shanne Sowards: I would say the first year and a half.

David Hirsch: And then what happened at a year and a half that was different?

Shanne Sowards: Well, a couple things happened. The place I was staying, I got kicked out of, and so a call kind of went out to the football team that said, “Hey, Shanne needs a place to stay.” So the girl I had actually taken to my junior prom, her family offered to let me stay there, and so I lived with them. They had a camping trailer in the backyard and they let me stay there.

They wanted me to stay in the house, but I was like, I was homeless, but I was proud, like I didn’t want a handout, so I slept in this trailer in the backyard. Not that’s because they didn’t want me there, but I had like five offers and that was the one I chose.

David Hirsch: So maintain some independence by staying there versus living in somebody else’s house.

Shanne Sowards: Yeah. And I was paying them a little bit of rent, and they didn’t want it, but I was like, “No, I can’t do that.” And then during this time I met this guy named Ben who was running a mentoring program for homeless teens, and my high school guidance counselor introduced me to him. And I was just like, “Oh.” I didn’t even know what mentoring was. The guy told me he was going to buy me soda once a week, and I was like, I like soda, especially free soda.

David Hirsch: So you’re probably 17.

Shanne Sowards: I’m 17. And once I started living there, they also said I could bring Kendra there, which was great. So I was getting her every other weekend, and I would stay inside the house when I had her.

I don’t remember how long I stayed out in the backyard. I don’t think it was too long. It was cold out there. Plus I was using a little electric space heater. I’m sure it was racking up their electric bill. My mentor kind of did some paradigm shifts, talked about the benefits of me sleeping inside the house, blah, blah, blah.

And so I started living inside the house and kind of becoming a part of the family. And it was great. I had the support. They would even give me rides to work. It was the first time in a long time that I actually had support, because I’ve been going solo. Before Ben, no one was even encouraging me to make any changes in my life. They’re just like, “Good job. You pay child support,” and that was it.

David Hirsch: Yeah. That bar was set very low.

Shanne Sowards: It was set very, very low. “Just pay child support. Well, you’re a good dad. Oh, you see her in a little bit. Yep. Great job.”

David Hirsch: Yeah. Well, it’s great that Ben stepped into your life and gave you some insights that you might not have been able to pick up on your own or from others that were involved.

So, let’s segue to the Squires program, because it was because of that relationship that you had with Ben, and the insights that he provided you, that really shed some light on what it means to be a dad. And it’s not just about paying child support. So flash forward to five years ago or so, Kendra would have been probably 20. You’re 35 then.

What was it that you experienced that you said, “I want to do something about this. I’ve got 20 years of experience being a dad, starting as a teenager.” What was it that motivated you to create the Squires program?

Shanne Sowards: There’s a couple of pieces to the story. It’s kind of long, but it’s valuable stuff.

Kendra had moved out, and our relationship is good, but it’s not where I’d love it to be. And I was really paying attention to, like, why is that? I worked hard. I always was working, and if I wasn’t working, I was volunteering at the church, doing youth ministry. And I had been looking at, “Man, my other two children are growing up, and I don’t want that to happen, continue to happen. I need to make some changes.”

David Hirsch: So let’s backtrack. There was a 20 year period of time from Kendra’s birth until the Squires program started, but in the interim you got married, and you have two children?

Shanne Sowards: I have two children. Kendra went to college. She graduated. She actually lived with us for her first year of college. It’s not a bad relationship. It’s just she was leaving the nest and then kind of is fine.

David Hirsch: So you and Beth were married when?

Shanne Sowards: And Beth and I were married in 2002.

David Hirsch: Okay. And you started another family, or you had some more kids?

Shanne Sowards: Yeah. Well, I mean, there’s a story there. Beth and I had Chelsea when I was 21, we weren’t married. It took me a few years…I think Chelsea was, wow, she was four before we actually got married. I always joke about how the brain science that we know today is that you’re about 25 before your brain is fully developed.

And about the time I turned 25, I looked at this woman who had been standing by my side through thick and thin, loving me no matter what. And I did some awful things. I’m like, what am I doing? Like, this woman is perfect, this is who I need to be with. And fortunately I hadn’t burned the bridge too bad, and we figured it out and got married.

David Hirsch: And then you had another child.

Shanne Sowards: Actually, no. Emily is not biologically my child. So we had Chelsea in ‘98, and then, like I said, I was immature, and I walked away from that relationship too. And then she had a child with another man. But there was always something between us. There’s always been something between us, and I figured my stuff out.

Man, it took me a while, but fortunately, she was…that relationship…well, I kind of bulldozed my way into that relationship. She was sort of in the relationship with that guy, and I was like, “No, no, we’re meant to be together.” So I would apologize to him, but I’m not sorry.

David Hirsch: Well, that is quite a story. Thank you for sharing it. So that gets us up to speedas far as your family, the three daughters, Kendra, Chelsea and Emily. And now you’re 35. What was it that motivated you to do something with other teen fathers and call it the Squires program?

Shanne Sowards: So I’d taken a new job. I had been in sales and customer service and it was work hard, play hard. My mind was always somewhere else. I was volunteering at the church all the time. And I got tired of being last month’s hero as far as sales go at work. And things were changing a little bit in my role at church, and I didn’t need to be as heavily focused.

I took this job at a chemical plant to be what I call a worker bee. I just wanted to show up and work. Well, it turns out I’m a hard worker, but I’m not just a worker bee. I’m going to ask ‘why’ five times. I’m going to really invest in myself, I really want to be a part of what I’m doing. That’s not what I sold them. It didn’t work out.

During the same time, when I first started this job, I was at a Bible study on Saturday morning and we were going through one of Eldredge’s books during their Bible study. And the question was, “If you have no hurdles, no obstacles, nothing was going to stop you, and you were going to succeed, what would you be doing with your life?”

Well, I had kind of shared this about the story about Ben and my life, and how if I won a million dollars, that’s what I’d do. I’d start a program for teen dads. And everyone’s like, “Oh, you should do that.” And I’d be like, “Yeah, well, who am I? I didn’t go to college. I’m just a dad. I’m nobody. Like, I’m not the guy.”

Well, this day comes, we have that question, and I don’t even share. I already know where this is going. And I thought I got away with it. And they’e like, “Wait, Shanne, you didn’t share. What would you do?”

I was like, “Ahh.” So I told them about Ben. I told them about this idea of what it would look like, sort of. Next thing I know it’s not a Bible study. It is a business planning meeting. There’s a flow chart and there’s all this stuff and you need a website and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And I just let them go on for about 20 minutes.

And then I finally said, “Okay, stop. The question was ‘If.’ If this, if that. I have hurdles, I have obstacles. I just started a new job. I can’t do this. I’m not your guy.” And they were like, “But you should do it!” I’m like, “No, I’m not your guy.” I drove home from that Bible study that day, and I’m driving down the road, and this billboard had been there for months and months and months. But it just said “Mentoring” in red and white letters.

I literally looked skyward. I’m like, “Leave me alone. I’m not your…look, stop!” And I get home, and my wife says, like she often does, “How was your study?” And I was like, “It happened again.” She’s like, “The mentoring thing?” I’m like, “Yeah.” She’s like, “Well, what are we waiting for?” I was like, “No, it gets better.” And I told her about the sign, and she was like, “Let’s do this.” I’m like, “No one’s listening to the question. No.” So I tabled it.

This job that wasn’t working out, I get fired. So I get fired from this job, and I get a letter from unemployment saying, “We don’t think you’re going to get into a job in the chemical plant industry. But there is a national program called SEA, Self Employment Assistance, where you get to collect unemployment benefits for six months, not look for work, and start your own small business.”

And I stood in my kitchen, and I cried. Because God had said, “I’ve removed your hurdles, removed your obstacles and your excuses. Just go love people.”

David Hirsch: It’s pretty powerful.

Shanne Sowards: That’s why I got to tell the whole story. It was just like all of those things fell into place to make that happen.

David Hirsch: So that gave you the opportunity to do that for six months with income coming in, and you got the green light to start this program. So what did you do? How did it start?

Shanne Sowards: I tell you one of the hardest things was just to come up with a name. And then I had to write a plan, write a business plan.

And so then I started interviewing nonprofits. Like, how do you start a nonprofit? I don’t know anything about this. And in the youth group that I served as junior high youth group leader for 14 and a half years, 15 years, something like that, one of the youth in the church actually happened to become a teen parent. And so I had my first dad.

David Hirsch: What was his name?

Shanne Sowards: His name was John. I started hanging out with him. And then the youth believed in what I was doing so much that they did a fundraiser, and they raised a bunch of funds. So then I have a little bit of money to mentor this guy. I got to take him to go get a soda or a coffee or whatever. Not knowing what I was doing, I was just like, I’m just going to love this kid and let him know that he matters.

And I just started making it up on the fly. I picked the name Squires because the idea of mentoring has been around for ages in medieval times. First you were a page, and then the squire. And then you finally became a knight. And you didn’t become a knight until you understood honor, country, love, valor, all of those things.

And you knew that because you were trained by honorable men before you. So that was the reason why I chose that name. So I have that money, and I put on a teen father workshop.

David Hirsch: How many people showed up?

Shanne Sowards: The last one, we had 27 people register, and we had 19 people there. It was pretty amazing. And a lot of the guys that you met today actually were in that workshop.

David Hirsch: That’s awesome. So there’s no formal curriculum for the Squires program currently, but that’s something you’re giving some thought to.

Shanne Sowards: Yes, it is something I’m totally giving some thought to. It’s kind of funny because one of the things I focus on is, rather than focusing on being a dad, I focus on being a man. Because what happens when you become a teen father is a lot of times you lose some of those rites of passage that allow you to become a man.

And so we have some little things loosely in place. I think long term what it’s going to look like, Is almost like some benchmarks that you have to do. Like you have to do so many hours of continuous improvement as a father. Part of it would be like you’ve completed 20 hours of reading to your child. You’ve participated in some sort of class to help you be a better father, and maybe some mindfulness, and just since critically thinking about how to be a better dad.

David Hirsch: What I admire most about you is that you’re totally dialed into what your children’s needs are. You’re in a meaningful relationship from a marital standpoint, so you have a strong base and some stability that you can offer your daughters.

And then beyond that, you feel compelled to do something in the lives of other people. And while anybody could mentor a teen father, I think the fact that you were a teen father yourself qualifies you in a way that others wouldn’t. I wouldn’t be able to mentor a teen father as successfully as you are, because you’re speaking from your personal experience.

I would just be speaking generically about what it means to be a dad, and there would be this disconnect, like what does that wealthy white guy from the suburbs know about teen fathering? So what if he has five kids? So we need to find more guys like yourself who are willing to get involved with the Squires program, or just deputize them somewhere, somehow, to be available to these young teen fathers.

So if there’s one piece of advice you could give to a teen father who’s listening, what would it be, Shanne?

Shanne Sowards: If you put the best interest of your child first, you’re never wrong. Always put what’s best for your child first. In my relationship with my kiddo, what that looked like is…I mean, we fought dirty with our young adolescent brains. We did. We did not fight fair. We had a lot of fights.

However, we did birthdays together. We spent Christmas together. We put that aside because it was important for our daughter. We didn’t talk bad about one another in front of our daughter, and we certainly didn’t allow others to talk bad about the other parent in front of her.

For us, that’s what putting our child’s best interests first looked like. That may not look the same for everyone, but that’s what it looked like for me. And that’s my best advice for anyone. It’s just if you’re doing it for your child’s best interest, you’re not wrong.

David Hirsch: Excellent. So we’re very fortunate to have one of the fellows who’s in your program, in the Squires program, with us. Quame, tell me briefly about your background. Where did you grow up? What type of relationship do you have with your own dad for that matter?

Quame: I grew up here in Portland, Oregon, in the north side. I moved around a lot. I would say before I was born, my dad and my mom had been together for 25 years, had my older brother named Quajo. He’s 26 now, and my sister who’s 24, before they had me and my little brother. He’s 16 right now.

David Hirsch: And you were older?

Quame: I’m 18. So we moved around. I grew up learning how to adapt really quick, to really fast situations. And I think that was just a skill I had just from going house to house and going from different schools to different schools and having to figure out how I’m gonna fit in here with this.

David Hirsch: So if I can paraphrase what you’ve said, your parents have been married for 25 years. There’s four of you, you’re number three out of the four children, and you’ve moved around a lot. So you’ve been in and out of different schools, so you’ve had to leave one school and your friends to go to another school. And it’s been challenging.

Quame: Yes, most definitely. And through all those challenges, I had my dad with me. And I would say, I would say that my dad sacrificed everything he had going for himself, for his kids. All four of them.

David Hirsch: So you’ve had an excellent role model for a father.

Quame: It made me want to be that figure. But then again, not make those types of sacrifices. Because then if he could have gone forward with this, maybe he could have helped us more financially in ways, rather than go from hotel to hotel, house to house, you know. I wanted to have his abilities, but still be able to stay strong with my plan and at least support them financially. And having a secure foundation more than he did would be a plus.

David Hirsch: Okay. So you’re how old now?

Quame: 18

David Hirsch: And how old were you when you became a father?

Quame: So I found out she was pregnant at age 15. So I came a father on July 6th, 2015, and I was 16 at the age.

David Hirsch: So your son is three years old now.

Quame: Yes, he is. And the mom’s water broke very early. And I remember that situation. And immediately after that, she went to the hospital, and she stayed six weeks in the hospital, waiting for the baby and all that. And every day I went up to the hospital. I’ll go to school. Her dad or her mom would come for me to substitute. But after school I’d take several buses all the way through town. Every day. It was a habit.

And I loved it, because it gave her somebody to feel comfortable with, and it gave me a purpose, to feel like somebody needs me. Me and the mom have been through a lot, and this is where I show my loyalty. We both made mistakes, but hey, we’re with each other on this one. So I kept on with my routine with that, and consistently made sure my name was signed in the book. July 16 and my baby boy King was there. His due date was actually in September.

David Hirsch: Oh my gosh.

Quame: So he’s two months premature.

David Hirsch: Oh my God. How much did he weigh when he was born?

Quame: 2.5.

David Hirsch: Holy moly.

Quame: So it’s kinda crazy, because we didn’t even get to see him the first day. He went straight to the incubator, and the mother had a C-section. She couldn’t have it regularly. So that took a bit too. And me as a father and as the mom, being young, just knowing the situation, knowing that I’m going to have to be the older one, that kind of stuff, the one that kind of gets the vision, maybe clarifies it.

So I stayed there with her. And she’s kind of bummed out that she couldn’t see the baby right after. We didn’t see him for another day. So the next day she went in there, saw him. And he couldn’t open his eyes, so he didn’t get to see us for the week or so. And we just saw his little face and movements and, oh yeah, he was just so small.

David Hirsch: So how long was King in the hospital after he was born?

Quame: Six months.

David Hirsch: Holy moly. Who covered that from a financial perspective?

Quame: OHP.

David Hirsch: So you didn’t have to pay for that individually. Do you know what the hospital bills were? Do you have any idea how much it cost?

Quame: But I know that it was probably off roof…

David Hirsch: I’m going to guess it was hundreds of thousands of dollars, if not maybe pushing a million dollars, just because that’s six months in the ICU and then beyond. Wow.

Quame: Yeah. He developed premature lung disease and that was around four months. Me and the mom noticed his breathing, his chest just enlarged. And I kind of felt disturbed by that, and knew that it wasn’t normal. And the baby next to him didn’t have that big chest. And the mom worried about it, but was scared to ask the doctor. So I kind of spoke up, and they found out he had premature lung disease, and he had two options for that.

David Hirsch: Did he have an operation?

Quame: Yes, he did. He had a tracheostomy surgery right after that. He was actually on the C-PAP for a long time, for about three months. And we wanted him home. Christmas is coming. And they kept telling us, “Oh, Thanksgiving, he’s going to be home Thanksgiving.” “Oh, he’s going to be home in December for Christmas.”

David Hirsch: So when you say coming home, are you and your girlfriend living together at the time after the baby was born?

Quame: No, I was actually wasn’t living at her house, but we were so close that kind of coming home to her house is my home. I call her home, my home, and I feel like it’s all one. I will always want my baby with his mom at all times. I just feel more comfortable like that.

David Hirsch: Are you still together?

Quame: No, we’re not.

David Hirsch: Okay.

Quame: And that kind of slowly wound down. So we got him checked out. His surgery came with a lot, because he was actually going to lose his ability to eat and swallow. So we have to do another surgery, which is a G tube, which inserts circle in your stomach for his feedings. And then we had a long tube and a ventilator, which I call Vinny now. Vinny is an air pressurizer. So my son will take the initial breath, and Vinny helps him breathe out.

David Hirsch: So is he still on the ventilator?

Quame: Yes. He is still on the ventilator.

David Hirsch: Now is there a plan to take him off the ventilator?

Quame: There hasn’t been a plan. We talked to Dr. Shaw numerous times, to see what the window frame is, and he gave us five years. So he’ll be probably five when he’s totally done with this.

And lately there’s been a slow down and kind a weaning process, which is just getting him on the lower settings. Because his feedings caused him throw up a lot and have all these aspirations and all that. So we had to slow down on the ventilator settings and focus more on the feeding schedule.

David Hirsch: Okay. So you’ve been involved with King’s life from the time he’s been born a new cm. How often now?

Quame: I see him now every week day, so Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, Friday from eight o’clock to five o’clock, 5:30. And I used to see him, I’ll say every day before then, Saturday and Sunday before.

Me and the mom had established some rules and boundaries every day, because as you said, that home was considered my home. I would go to school and come straight there and everything used to be at that house. Now I kind of found out I was pushing myself, maybe doing more than what I’m capable of, even though my boy loved it.

But I knew like my dad had, I don’t want to make that sacrifice. Hey, I still have a beautiful future, beautiful career. I have a beautiful vision in front of me, and I’ve been here for my son. And like your dad, you might have to make that sacrifice. But I want to find a good balance. So I gave up going to California for football.

David Hirsch: So you had a full ride scholarship.

Quame: Yeah. I thought that was one of my biggest achievements. And that sacrifice is when I says, you know what, King is so much like me. You know? He was born on a Monday like me. He’s born around the same time I was two hours. I came two hours before him. But yeah. That’s who I do it for. That’s my purpose. That’s what I was playing out on the football field for, you know? So most definitely took down that scholarship and said, I’m going to swallow it, and set a plan B, go to full time to PCC, and this music. And I’m doing absolutely astonishing. My grades are nowhere near what they were in high school. I’m excited to go to school, and I’ve never been excited to go to school.

David Hirsch: Well, that’s great to hear that. Thanks for sharing, Quame. So how did you meet Shanne and the Squires program?

Quame: I met Shanne on one of those teen father workshops.

David Hirsch: Was it the third one?

Shanne Sowards: It was the fourth one.

Quame: Yeah. And I was in my counselor’s room, and we would have lunches. She just had this paper on there about teen fathers. A couple of days previous, me and my dad had a conversation just about fatherhood in general. So I was open, and I didn’t even look at the paper. She just said food was going to be there. She knows how to get my attention.

David Hirsch:  How old would have King been when you learn about the Squires program?

Quame: One, I would say.

David Hirsch: So two years ago.

Quame: Yeah. So, I heard food. I said, “What time?” And I said, “Well that’s kinda kind of far.” It was in Milwaukie, and I was in Portland.

David Hirsch: So how far was that? How did you have to travel to get there?

Quame: 30 minutes in the car with my dad.

David Hirsch: What was it that you heard? Because you were there for the food, but what was it that you heard that you said, “I want this”?

Quame: It was just the experience, what I found around me, the room, the people, the environment, the opportunities, the difference in my life, the change. Something could happen. And obviously God’s set up a piece of paper that said, “Hey, there’s going to be food there. Just get there. I’ll make it worth it. Just get there.”

David Hirsch: Okay, so you went, you had a good experience then. What was your second interaction with the Squires program?

Quame: Ah, it was actually the following Thursday. And it had pizza.

David Hirsch: So Shanne, note to self: food’s important.

Shanne Sowards: Oh, I know.

Quame: Seeing that and all the other dads that probably did the same thing I did, and showed up the next day. And after that, it was the next Thursday and next Thursday. I started taking my son out for the first time by myself, and with all the medical condition, all the equipment, and I felt so proud of myself. So like a father, like this is what it feels like. You know? It just made me cry in a way, just in a happy way, like it finally happens. There’s baby steps, the small steps, that it’s gonna happen.

And then I got to see my boy play with the kids, and then like, “Oh, he’s a little bit different.” But then to see that he’s just like everybody else in a way. He’s playing, interested, and he wants to build the blocks, and fighting around too. He has two friends there named Shane and John, and they’re about like five, six, way older than my boy. He just loves them. And anytime we go home after Tuesday, he’s just talking about them all the time.

David Hirsch: So if you had to identify one thing or maybe two things, what’s the one or two things that you’ve learned from the Squires program that are the most important to you?

Quame:  That I can really make a difference, and I can make a difference to the other person. One person can make a difference in the home.

David Hirsch: That’s awesome. Well, Quame, thank you for sharing some insights

Quame: Thank you so much. This is so wonderful, what Shanne did. Changed my life.

David Hirsch: Well, thank you, gentlemen. This was fabulous.

Shanne Sowards: Thank you so much for having us.

Tom Couch: The Special Fathers Network is a dad to dad mentoring program for fathers raising children with special needs. Through our personalized matching process, new fathers with special needs children connect with mentor fathers in a similar situation. It’s a great way for fathers to support fathers.

Sometimes the mentor father is just there to answer a few questions. Sometimes they become good friends. It’s a proven support system for new fathers with special needs kids. If you’re a father looking for support, or if you’re a dad who’d like to offer support, go to 21stcenturydads.org.

David Hirsch: And thank you for listening to the Special Fathers Network Podcast, stories of fathers helping fathers.

Tom Couch: The Special Fathers Network Podcast was produced for 21st Century Dads by Couch Audio. And again, to find out more about the Special Fathers Network, go to 21stcenturydads.org.